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 Post subject: Dieing in water
 Post Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2008 7:34 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2008 2:07 am
Posts: 1045
The fact that magnetic beacon and call from the pit etc are so powerful is that land creatures die in the water. We are thinking of changing it where creatures just take damage when in water rather than die.


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 Post subject: Re: Dieing in water
 Post Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2008 7:59 pm 
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Joined: Wed Nov 19, 2008 8:19 am
Posts: 31
Good to hear...thanks!


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 Post subject: Re: Dieing in water
 Post Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2008 9:37 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2008 4:21 pm
Posts: 265
Location: California
jed wrote:
The fact that magnetic beacon and call from the pit etc are so powerful is that land creatures die in the water. We are thinking of changing it where creatures just take damage when in water rather than die.


Jeez, no. That takes part of the game away by minimizing the importance of terrain


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 Post subject: Re: Dieing in water
 Post Posted: Wed Dec 10, 2008 11:07 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 01, 2008 4:05 am
Posts: 137
Location: Cincinnati OH
Heck No, its one of the nice dynamics that make it unique, it makes for awsome strategy. Now what are you gonna do with a wind mogi, or magnetic beacon or a dozen other cards if you do that. If theres any big issue, make an ability that makes something undrownable, the undead drown is kinda odd in and of itself really, although they get that whole not living loophole on a handfull of spells so good for them. While losing a creature to a watertrap is never a pleasant experience its a solid part of the game.

What i would like to know, is what factor is making you consider this in the first place?

Concept and Flavor? It is odd a few creatures can be drowned, although you can logic out some of it, you knock a bolder into water i dont think its going to manage its way out not that it would neccisarily drown, or a undead drowing, yeah its a little wonky but in MTG slime can wear fullplate and be blessed and trees can breath fire, doesn't make any more sense.

Or player complaints about it perhaps, Your never gonna make everyone happy, using the paramount example again MTG uses land distruction, discard, and counterspells all of which are hugely unpopular with players (especialy beginners) usualy this comes from one of two things, not understanding how to play around it or an inability to use the same tricks.

I LOVE this effect and have lost quite a lot of guys to being teleported into water or pushed with wind mogi, its a dynamic of the game.

In fact i would love to see more dangerous terrain, lava spaces that deal damage, dark forests that reduce vision. Bogs that lower movement over time till units sink in and drown. Don't shoot the game in the foot cause someone told you the gun was empty.


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 Post subject: Re: Dieing in water
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 12:38 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 01, 2008 7:14 am
Posts: 89
Location: Victoria, BC
I think this is a great idea.

My only concern is that while aquatic creatures are probably too safe right now that they will become too vulnerable if the movement/attack cost is not high enough, three seems appropriate. I'd like to know if we can get a list put on ocean spaces so we know how much it costs to move through for different types of creature.


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 Post subject: Re: Dieing in water
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 12:41 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 04, 2008 12:05 am
Posts: 385
Location: South of Sanity
Personally, I don't like the idea. It is a strategic part of the game, sometimes it works for you and others against.. like plenty of other things. People seem to get hung up on water-kill for some reason. If your deck revolves around one big baddie that you lost to the water and you can't win the game now... you may want to reconsider deck construction techniques... lysis will break you too. As much as I HATE that card, you don't hear much complaint about that one.


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 Post subject: Re: Dieing in water
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 1:33 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 01, 2008 4:29 pm
Posts: 254
Agreed. Thing drown in water, it happens. One possibility is to give some units a new ability like Underwater [X], where that creature takes X damage each round it's in water. The other ones can just die.

It's just a middleground suggestion, and I don't know if I'm even sold on it.

_________________
-Minds


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 Post subject: Re: Dieing in water
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 6:32 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2008 2:07 am
Posts: 1045
The idea is that it would do 2 or 3 HP of damage each round that a creature stays in water. So small guys would still die like they do now.

The issue is this:
Cards that move guys around the map or change terrain are cool.
They are useful in so many situations not just throwing the other guys dudes into water.
The fact that you can kill pretty much any creature with these cards means that they need to be more expensive. (Naturescaping vs Cloudburst)
So if you use them to do other things rather than just kill creatures you are not being efficient.
So basically the fact that you can easily kill creatures by moving them around means that we can't have cards that allow you to cheaply move creatures. They basically have to cost the same as lysis which doesn't seem good.

It also makes the game more discontinuous. Magnetic beacon can either dominate or be worthless.


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 Post subject: Re: Dieing in water
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 6:47 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 01, 2008 4:05 am
Posts: 137
Location: Cincinnati OH
well stuff like naturescaping doesnt effect occupied terrain, you could do cards that change terrain to anything BUT ocean more common. And thats one thing ive been wanting is to be able to have some control over geographics from the start of the game. Just make it a special format or something. I'd be more for tweeking a few cards like magnetic beacon, which i haven't seen as a particularly effective card. The dropping the water kill.


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 Post subject: Re: Dieing in water
 Post Posted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 3:13 pm 
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Joined: Sun Nov 02, 2008 10:04 pm
Posts: 348
I support this change. I think 2 damage per round is still a strong motivation to use the cards and adds to the strategy rather than diminishes it.


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