Point 1: I've seen my share of individuals grow up with every possible opportunity, given everything they'd ever wanted, and they pissed it all away leading dismal, shallow lives. On the other hand I've seen people given nothing work hard to earn just a little, and lead happy, rewarding lives. That's what I was getting at when I said you have to work for things to appreciate them. That said, I concede that this does NOT apply to all things in this world.

Point 2: Socialism is NOT a bad thing. The ONLY people it's bad for are the 1% of the population who control 95% of the wealth. And these people have enough money to live comfortable lives thousands of times over. Pure capitalism ISN'T inherently free, it's inherently oppressive, as it encourages the concentration of wealth and power in FEW hands. Sure, "freedom of choice and enterprise" is great propaganda, but unfortunately that's ALL it is. It has no meaning when good people can't afford to eat, buy medicine, put a roof over their head, pay for education, or have a job that pays a livable wage. Tonight I saw a sneak preview of Michael Moore's new film, "Capitalism: A Love Story", and there was a great cut of president FDR proposing an amendment to the US constitution for a second bill of 'economic' rights-- circa 1944. Sadly, these "socialist" ideas were not implemented in the US, but WERE implemented into many of the new constitutions of nations rebuilt after WWII (i.e. Italy, Germany, Japan, for example). You can listen to these "radical" ideas from FDR here-- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czvHtOh_Xew

Frankly I agree with FDR. Without the economic rights in his list, mainstream populations will always exist in some varying degree of economic oppression.

I don't get how one could game a system so easily. I recall hearing some about US's medical insurance prices(friends who studied there groan and moan about it).


Lol, i was kinda lost untill the ending, then it all clicked togather.

About the rich vs the poor, I think it differs also from country to country.
Over in malaysia, the majority get special privilages and discounts on things like and and intrest rates cos they WERE originally rather poor semi-village people. The non-majority races/religions have and HAS prospered even with said disadvantages along side the majority race. So one one hand, you have some people claiming some are lazy and get it easy, while others say they worked hard to get where they are. Both are equally valid statements, and while I do not believe it is wrong to be rich, I believe in generosity when you are well to do and/or can afford it. If I was to go infinite(lonnng way to go), I wouldn't mind providing incentives to newbies I believe will stay and be a solid player.

MMM, yea. On my side, at one point in time, I lived alone after high school, and lived on...... USD85 a month, for bfast/lunch/dinner and whatever else.(not in usa tho) I appreciated the extra help some friends did like help drive me places, the occasional free food from my relative and all that. I could walk(and indeed would walk 15 mins+ in the rain to college), or just eat more instant noodles, but then, I really appreciate the free stuff(and them) that they gave, eating/using it sparingly.
To be fair, if ANYONE gave me USD10,000 *discreet cough* I would use it as carefully as if I had worked for it, cos 10K is still 10K, regardless how much sweat and blood is stuck on the money. I would stand to lose thousands if I don't manage said 10K well regardlessly of how I got it.


I which is why i brought up the lysis thing. I could get it, and would be happy(and also appreciate said card), as it would be my 1st real/virtual card. (sounds weird somehow, "real-virtual")


Of course thats me, I was attempting to give an alternative view on how some people treat free stuff. Not everyone values free stuff below worked-for stuff. (not that its wrong to justify your actions otherwise)


Ah.

True dat. I like the way, in an episode of "Lost" where Sayid and a girl is about to make out, and she asks something along the lines if he was expecting it. He answered he didn't come with expectations, but with hope.


Hear, Hear. If I didn't think its worth the time coming here, I wouldn't be in the forums spending time with you all. Everyone who gives card ideas, suggestions and all that all show they want the game to improve, including teaching newbies and welcoming newbies into TFW. I've played lots of online games, free ones, and its hard to find a free-bie friendly one like this place. So naturally, I would want to poke the forums and help newbies as others helped me. (Off the top of my head, I can recall TheFlashPoint and ThePoz for helping me early on)

That said, I find the below statement of disservice to TFW's friendlyness:

THe hell is that suppose to mean, Keyser? You think I go around throwing games to get free cards?
So you know, IIRC, we havnt laddered in the last ladder, and i no way solicitated I wanted cards from him.

lol...

I lived in europe for several years, I guess they have REALLY cleaned up the place since that time. Everyone and everything is peachy, perfect, groovy now apparently. From my perspective the sky appears blue and the clouds appear white. That is all.

Chillaxin,

DarkJello

P.S. 77% of statistics are false yaron.

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Ad astra per alia porci!$!

To all the naysayers out there, this is my well-thought out, irrefutable, highly logical, indisputable response:

"Oh yeah? Have you ever played to the 100th round? Collected more than 150 flux? No? Pfft, noob!"*

*a special thanks to Zavia
*see his post for more information

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Altren wrote:

I agree with Keyser, and that's what I'm planning to implement actually.

|| The Rise of the DCC | Plasmatium Netherious | Tastes Like Chicken | The Astridian Conspiracy ||

Guild -> | Platypus Rising|

thats.. thats.... cheating...?

Peachiness and grooviness are relative. In almost every index imaginable, Europeans are better off than Americans (unless you're only looking at the top 10%, economically, of the population).



An old lawyers' adage goes: "If the facts are on your side, bang on the facts. If the law is on your side, bang on the law. If neither the facts nor the law are on your side, bang on the table."

I tried banging on the law (by explaining why I believe the ethics of capitalism are flawed). I tried banging on the facts (by quoting some relevant statistics). Your response to both of these has been banging on the table ("purple monkeys and schooners", and now the old cliche about statistics). Since no real discussion seems forthcoming, I'm quitting in frustration.



Well, well. I thought I had you pegged, and then you say this. That should teach me.

A NEW RECORD!

I don't think I've ever had my username reposted in other people's posts or my text quoted so many times in one thread!

lol

yaron:

You made wildy false statements about how perfect everything in Europe is now. My comments about purple monkeys and the history of schooners was every bit as accurate.

Democracy and capitalism > any other system. You appear to be advocating for a system that has never succeeded. Never. Ever. I prefer to support and defend ideals that have a chance of success. Rewarding mediocrity is a recipe for... continued mediocrity at best. Democracy fails when a majority of people choose laziness, indifference, immorality, evil. Every other system fails when a tiny percentage of people choose laziness, indifference, immorality, evil.

A small percentage of Americans don't have health insurance. It would be super to decrease this number. I believe it should be done responsibly. There are TONS of loopholes and ways to cheat the system currently. Again, why not make the system more efficient first? This is based on my real-world experience, NOT some number I found on the website of a country I loathe. Why don't these people have insurance? If they truly are in need there is ALREADY guaranteed coverage for them!!! They have to choose to sign up. If they are illegals, as many are, they are fearful of being deported. If some want to spend money on a new truck INSTEAD of insurance that is their choice. I guess it is just easier to look at the percentage and complain instead of looking below the surface as to why some don't have insurance... Another 100% false assumption is that having insurance automatically = improvement. Based on the track record of too-powerful governments throughout history I am VERY skeptical.

I believe that 600 years ago yaron's ancestors were mean to my ancestors, and since nobody really owns anything anyway, I humbly request that yaron now transfer all of his wealth to me. That sounds perfectly logical according to his theory of ownership.

Three days ago someone stole the biggest pumpkin from my garden! (Yes, this really just happened). Pardon me if I oppose a system that will do the same to me and my children AFTER we have done all the work for months and months to grow something. Enough "legal" stealing is already occurring as is anyway.

Opposing mediocrity and laziness,

DarkJello

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Ad astra per alia porci!$!

@Darkjello-- A few thoughts.

1) Democracy and Capitalism are completely different things, and have nothing to do with one another. Our system of government is not defined by our economy. Unless of course you meant that Capitalism > Democracy, because Wall Street and the ultra rich are in control of the government. But you won't find anything about Capitalism in the US constitution.

2) "Providing for the General Welfare" is, however in the constitution. A phrase that embraces the essence of Socialism. One of biggest problems today is that the average person has been spoon fed propaganda about how great Capitalism is, and how evil Socialism is all their lives. If you didn't listen to my FDR link earlier in this thread, I really think you should. It's only ~2 minutes... and if you find yourself thinking that his ideas seem reasonable, then congratulations! You're in favor of a moderate amount of Socialist policies.

3) The illegal immigrants notion is a boogie man. Saying that you won't have the ability to "choose" is a boogie man. The notion of a government that is "too powerful" is a boogie man. The idea that people not having basic services available via a government safety net (i.e. health insurance) won't make a difference is completely insane. It is ALL propaganda my friend. McCarthyism at its best in the 21st century. Btw, what's this about healthcare already existing for those in need? Were you talking about Medicare? That's an existing form of socialized medicine.

It is the responsibility of every government to protect and provide for its people. People not having access to the basic essentials of life-- food, shelter, health care, education and decent work IS a travesty. The REAL crime. Finally, I recommenced you cease consuming mainstream US media if you want access to real information-- the 4th estate no longer serves the people.

*political hugs* Just because I'm arguing with you doesn't mean I don't like you.